Part 0ne, here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oTRJB8S09QA
and Part Two, here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lyyefXBSXSQ
After I forwarded it to Bob for comment, he responded far more thoughtfully than I would have. Bob's reply reflects the lessons learned in the 90s when we made mistakes based on inexperience. Bob obviously learned those lessons better than I did.
Mike
III
Anonymous said...
I strongly agree with MUCH of what Bob Wright said. Sadly, Mr. Wright flushes the credibility of his cause and principles down the toilet when he speaks of his support and submission to "law enforcement".
I take a back seat to NO ONE on the issue and support of law and order and our being a nation of law.
The police have long ago stopped being public servants of the community and have militarized and armed themselves to serve as a TERRORIST arm of "government" to extract revenue, control our lives & property, and violently enforce submission to the all powerful neo-fascist "God State" through the employment of terrorist torture, property seizure, and the rape of our privacy, due process, and right not to be subject to cruel and unusual punishment not to mention rampant, pandemic, nationwide corruption.
I am NOT anti-police.....on the contrary, I am PRO Quality, Ethically honest, Constitutional, Accountable, Officers of CHARACTER, INTEGRITY, & MORALITY, and COMMUNITY ORIENTED Police.
The police take the SAME oath I took as a military officer, only I took my oath SERIOUSLY.
I agree that Bob Wright has the right idea about the Constitution. INDEED our politians and the police state they have created while "WE THE SHEEPLE" comfortably sat and EAGERLY DEMANDED this police state from our neo-fascist, statist politicians in exchange for safety and comfort have become domestic enemies who employ DOMESTIC TERRORIST sheep dogs to keep the sheep in line.
Like Bob Wright, I am fed up with being a "subject" and second class citizen in my OWN HOME of the now dead Republic of The United States of AmeriKa.
Our "government" and the terrorist thugs it employs to abuse and control us have become modern day RED COATS. If left unchecked they WILL strip us ALL of our arms, property, freedom, liberty, and even our belief and faith in our creator.
July 6, 2009 5:22 AM
And this is Bob's reply:
Jeeze Mike,
My first reaction is, this is just silly. The only reference I can remember in the speech is saying we converse with law enforcement. So any thing about "submission" is the fantasy of the author. But this post does represent a certain section of the movement so I will try to provide a cogent response to something I never said or implied.
This style of post is always with us and I suppose give some satisfaction to the author and others of his mind set. If we look at the post and analyze its content we will better understand the agenda of the author and perhaps get an insight into why our glorious cause does not prosper as we feel it should.First let us look at the post and it's structure. Mr. Anonymous declares my credibility "flushed down the toilet" based on the statement that we Converse with law enforcement. If one listens to the speech one finds no reference either implied or expressed regarding "submission" to law enforcement.
Scanning the rest of the document it seems the declaration of my cause and principles being flushed down the toilet was sufficient for the imperial Mr. Anonymous to just hijack the rest of the post to use as his podium to beat his chest about how he is this and how he will take a back seat to no one etc. etc. These efforts to convince the reader of his courage and or superiority as a Patriot are of course punctuated with trite and way over used invective, ALWAYS IN CAPITOL LETTERS, so we all know he's really, really mad and really really serious and so much more so than whomever he is denigrating with talk of flushed credibility.
I am trying to be nice about this but this is the foolishness that has kept our movement in turmoil for more than 20 yr . I cannot know where the poster resides as he posted as anonymous (of course) but I will bet a silver dollar that he knows nothing of the Lea Co. Sheriffs office or their relationship with the 1st. Brigade. But some word or phrase he heard, or thought he heard failed his standard of uber patriot so he writes me off,, my cause off, and my principles off.
Now about the foolishness, If I were to follow the usual process associated with these difficulties I would now respond indignantly!!!!!!!! I would wail and gnash my teeth in agonies of wounded self righteousness. listing ad. infinatum my accomplishments , the risks I've taken, the money I've spent etc. in order to "prove" that I am a super Patriot who has been wounded by a wannabe who lacks the courage to even sign his name to the poison words he has authored. Following my traumatic defense of my self my Friends on the blog would affirm in terms glowing and noble my unimpeachable credibility as a Super Patriot. Naming the scurrilous poster as a wannabe, or a plant by the New World Order etc. Of course we would use lots!!!! of exclamation points and ALL CAPITAL words so you will know we are really, really mad and really, really serious. We would look at the post and see the damning and ugly words he used to condemn law enforcement, then because we are bigger super patriots than he we would find uglier and stronger names to call Law Enforcement.
Following our brilliant defense of myself, your supporters would mirror the actions of mine and in just a couple of electronic exchanges we would have permanently separated one part of the Patriot Movement from the other. We would have made a ridiculous spectacle of ourselves and provided a tremendous turn off to all newbees who watch this sad fracas.. So before we do something so foolish, I will assure you that in no way did I state or imply that to be legitimate the Militia had to submit to law enforcement Watch the video again Mr. Anonymous, listen this time. We are in no competition. I will endeavor to make the point you have misunderstood clearer in future speeches.
Let Unity for Liberty be our parting call.
Bob Wright
14 comments:
Now, that reply was good! Needless to say, there won't be a rebuttal!:)
Wisdom and experience are two invaluable qualities for an effective leader. Bob's measured, calm response is a wonderful example of those qualities.
/salute
I too wondered what Anon was talking about. I listend to the speach and only heard about speaking to the sheriff, which is a good idea if you are going to have a lot of guys running around with guns at a training even on private property. In fact, it would be great if the sheriff would join the militia, support it, or at least not hamper the effort.
I went back and watched Bob Wright's speeches a second time to be sure I didn't miss anything. There was NO hint there that we should "submit" to the police or other gubmint authorities.
Indeed it sounds like so much "chest thumping" to me as well.
As one of those who too-often fizzes off at the least hint of provocation, it's instructive to observe how Bob turned that.
Gosh, I wish I could do that... ;-)
Bob's speech just seemed to have a general attitude of mysticism and respect for government and "law" to me. Something that doesn't agree with my outlook, to be sure, but something common among constitutionalists.
I would like to know, though, how someone can on one hand acknowledge that government has no authority to disarm us, but on the other hand claim government has the authority to draw "borders" and enforce them. How can you have a government strong enough to do one without getting the other as part of the package deal?
We are not talking about "trespassing" here, since that is a private property issue and should be dealt with individually, but an attitude that the federal government has a prior claim on my property and has the authority to control what I do with it, and who I may allow on it.
There is government AND tyranny, or there is freedom. Government and freedom are mutually exclusive. Freedom means there will be some things you don't like. Tough. Adults deal with these consequences themselves instead of invoking the religion of the state, including its "Bible" (the Constitution) to solve things for them.
I'm not trying to start a fight or get anyone to agree with me; just expressing my thoughts on this so that maybe you will understand why some people might not be quite as excited about his speech as others are.
Some folks would bitch about being hung with a new rope. Which historically was a kindness as a stiff new rope would snap the neck cleanly rather than let the prisoner slowly strangle.
In any case Anon appeared to be IMHO an asshat looking to agrandize himself at the expense of hijacking a serious debate.
As for government in general, I am in Heinlein's words a "rational anarchist" meaning that I consider all government evil, but given the imperfect nature of man some accomodations are necessary for mutual survival. And I believe that by whatever means the founders managed to come closer to a workable government that any other I know of. It means that some times the government steps on your toes. If it happens too often and especially if the government decides they have a right to toe step then one does what one must. There are always three options: change the situation within the law, leave, or violently revolt. Each has a price. Oh, and the fourth and apparently most popular option, sit back and bitch and complain about how unfair the world is.
"Needless to say" this is not a rebuttal, just pointing out how I perceived some things said in the speech.
"Law enforcement knows about us, we converse with them, we've hid nothing".
"converse" is defined as the following:
1 to have acquaintance or familiarity b: to become occupied or engaged
2 to exchange thoughts and opinions in speech : talk or to carry on an exchange
Fair enough. Bob, perhaps the sheriff and local law enforcement in your area may be honest, credible,and trust worthy people. This is NOT the case with law enforcement where I live. The experience of many community leaders who deal with them can best be described as the compulsive and overwhelming need for a shower after speaking or dealing with our sheriff or his department. This is my appraisal as well.
Apparently either you or your Sheriff felt the need to communicate. As I see it, what you lawfully do on private property is YOUR business. The lawless environment I live in leads MANY to the conclusion that NOTHING gets said our sheriff & what lawfully takes place on our private property is none of his business, be it an Appleseed shoot or otherwise. They are not welcome.
Judging by the emotional & indignantly overly sensitive response, I have apparently touched on a VERY sensitive subject. I am disappointed with the personal but colorful personal affronts and scoffs resorted to in your reply. I will defend your right to express yourself as poorly as you wish. I will pass along that "going off half cocked" typically yields poor results.
I posted what I thought was my opinion and perception of viewing the video in what I felt was a respectful albeit non-conformist manner. Not sure just how the "imperialist", "invective", and "chest beating" fits in there?
My ego is seasoned enough to take some heat and criticism although in my opinion it falls far short of "measured" or "calm" in this instance.
Bob, I have a LOT of respect for your cause and the huge amount of time, effort, and expense you & your supporters must put into what you are doing. Not only do I applaud what you are doing, I wish you the best, and GREAT success.
I wish more people would attend these Tea Parties. I am active in that respect & was very disappointed to see less than 20 people show up for the local 4th of July Tea Party in our county of over 16,000 people.
I can see CLEARLY that you have not had the "education" & experience of having to live under a corrupt law enforcement and political regime that empowers local thugs, drug dealers, has members of its agency arrested by the FBI and BATFE for selling illegal firearms to felons without an FFL, openly abuses the law, prisoners, & its citizens.
Perhaps you have never been the object of an unlawful search, arrest, had property stolen from you, or been asssaulted & threatened by the police. Give it some time....."The Messiah" and his administration just may educate you as well although I certainly hope not.
Perhaps because of my and many others experience with respect to the police abuse, corruption, and terrorism issue, I may be be viewing & interpreting through a less than objective lense, although I doubt it.
Apparently you have taken person offense to my opinion comments which were NOT intended to be take as such & for that I express my sincere apologies.
In closing, I respectfully suggest you walk a mile in the other man's shoes BEFORE passing judgement or backing up the dump truck of ad hominem expressions and similar drivvle.
Oh yeah...I don't have a Google Account & the other options are not particularly user friendly as I was pressed for time. If you don't want annoymous replies; remove the option. It is hypocritical to make the option available then make critical comments about using it when someone does.
I will INDEED Let Unity for Liberty be our parting call.
Anon says, "Apparently you have taken person offense to my opinion comments which were NOT intended to be take as such & for that I express my sincere apologies."
That would have been the best thing to post on your way out, and left it at that. All the butthurt on both sides of it makes it a non-apology.
Bob Wright's thoughtful reply indicates that he is a man of good character, and he is apparently lucky enough to live in a county where the sheriff is also a man of integrity.
It is good that Anon came back and clarified. He perhaps is not so lucky to have such an upstanding sheriff-the highest law enforcement official in OUR country.
Would it were that we had more Bob Wright style inclusiveness, because methinks we all gonna need it.
There is no "one size fits all." Those of us fighting for liberty and justice should not be using stereotypes and broad brushes.
Let's judge each other with objective criteria, one at a time, case by case whenever possible - while we remember that trust and respect are earned the same way.
The hard ass attitude toward ALL "law enforcement" types, refusing to find and nurture the "peace officer" types among them, is obviously easiest... but by doing so we may not recognize - or worse - drive away some who would become our friends and allies.
Stranger things have happened...
I do not know either Mr. Anonymous or Mr. Wright, but I've been on both sides of this coin.
There are LEOs out there that are not to be trusted just like there are LEOs out there that will be some of our best friends when the real fighting starts.
More importantly though is this fact: "Gentleman, we must hang together, or we will most assuredly hang separately."
It is difficult to understand each others viewpoint perfectly since we all have different backgrounds.
We have had ample opportunity and time to beat on each other (whether intended or not, whether real or not, mattereth not). We have now reached that point in time that we must put this behind us, square up our shoulders, and march together. The other side is doing that (has been for some time now). That's why they're "winning".
Find the LEOs you CAN trust. Perhaps more importantly, find those you CAN'T trust and make sure we all know about them.
I'm glad to hear that Bob is on good terms with his local LEOs.
I'm not surprised to hear that Mr. Anon doesn't live in such circumstances as there are far too many such circumstances out there right now with LEOs pushing the limits to see when we'll react (we certainly not acting, after all).
I enjoyed Bob's speech. I would love to head down to NM and train with him a bit since I can't seem to get anyone up my way to take this stuff seriously.
There are already too few of us prepared and ready to strike back like a pit viper who gets stepped on. Let's move past this and stick together.
Scott Bishop
Orem, UT
(sorry, but I, too, do not have a Google account yet)
CorbinKale,
I am not particularly concerned with your opinion, however, you might try remembering the 1st rule of civil discourse "on your way out"........check your ego at the door. I'll pick mine up on the way out. :O)
Apparently, many are still in the sheep/politically asleep frame of mind with respect to how law enforcement across the country views citizens and their liberties.
Please consider this a humble but friendly suggestion for a small example of some infomative and "educational" reading and listening.
http://www.infowars.com/shreveport-citizens-disarmed-by-police-for-2nd-amendment-bumper-stickers/
http://republicbroadcasting.org/?p=3007
Big, out of control, and over reaching government as well as its neo-domestic terrorist arm of law enforcement are NOT compatible with those who understand and seek to protect Constitutional liberties and the rights endowed to us by our creator.
Have a nice day.
So how do we get something like that in my part of the country?
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