Comments on Pro Libertate: Why The Regime Must Lose In Iraq

BEYOND ARROGANCEIt was well-known that Pakistan´sD...

2007-10-31T08:54:00.000-06:00

BEYOND ARROGANCE

It was well-known that Pakistan´s
Dictatorship might fall,
Yet repercussion in Japan´s
Flared unequivocal.

´Tis not wise to impose, impinge
On friendship overmuch;
As now friends of this land must cringe
Because the bully´s touch.

More than mere arrogance--if there
Had been some principle
Behind it one may be cocksure--
But it bodes never well

To pressure friends, for one´s own greed
To give up lots of stuff,
Concede, concede, and more concede,
Because one treats them rough.

Another Burke quote, courtesy of George McGovern:A...

2007-04-25T10:50:00.000-06:00

Another Burke quote, courtesy of George McGovern:

A conscientious man would be cautious how he dealt in blood.

Though I'm not unduly deferential to John Stuart M...

2007-04-25T05:50:00.000-06:00

Though I'm not unduly deferential to John Stuart Mill's perspective (since I'm not a utilitarian), I certainly agree with the statement quoted above.

I will point out that people willing to hire out as armed enforcers for the degenerate regime that rules us aren't necessarily "better" men, any more than were the Hessians who did George III's bidding. Those within the military who enlisted to serve our country, rather than the regime, are even more disgusted by the depraved Iraq war than I am.

As to those things for which I am ready and prepared to fight, see the following entries:

http://freedominourtime.blogspot.com/
2006/08/these-are-my-sons_25.html

http://freedominourtime.blogspot.com/
2006/09/how-to-handle-draft-nappers-fantasia_
07.html

http://freedominourtime.blogspot.com/
2007/04/second-amendment-constitution-in.html

"War is an ugly thing but not the ugliest of thing...

2007-04-24T22:42:00.000-06:00

"War is an ugly thing but not the ugliest of things; the decayed and degraded
state of moral and patriotic feelings which thinks that nothing is worth war
is much worse. A man who has nothing for which he is willing to fight,
nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable
creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the
exertions of better men than himself."

~John Stuart Mill

Will, I'm almost certain that I probably go agains...

2007-04-24T06:39:00.000-06:00

Will, I'm almost certain that I probably go against your grain when I speak of “commoners,” or us essentially, our way of thinking and, by extension, how we walk (vote, live our life) instead of how we talk, being the real issue. One's actions speak louder than one's words, after all, in reflecting one's real character, integrity, and so forth.

Anyway, let me start by saying I agree with your entire premise here and Burke certainly qualifies as a patriot among historical figures of the founding era precisely because of the stalwart character he obviously displayed in public venues and by his actions, despite the risks. Ergo, your “Burkeisms,” as it were, quoted here in this context couldn’t be more apropos, IMO.

That said, I have one question that I think you, with your demonstrated high-caliber intellect can perhaps answer qualitatively for my uneducated mind. I didn’t graduate HS after all ;).

You said:

The one that follows seems almost perfectly tailored to fit our present circumstances, in which a self-enraptured ruler and his courtiers – none of whom has known the terrors of combat – have bullied much of the public into supporting their disastrous crusade...

I'm curious. Why do you say “bullied” in regard to the commoners vs. Leviathan in this particular context? Yes, the emphasis is there on purpose because, in general, yes, one could state that Leviathan is force and bullies its subjects, which would certainly be true, but nevertheless somewhat equivocal. However, in this particular context, I must say, the commoners haven’t been “bullied” in any way that I can see. If you're implying by saying “bullied” that the public was forced, coerced, or otherwise compelled in some fashion to support the Iraq War, how so?

I fully understand that to drill home a larger point concerning Leviathan one has to purposely and poignantly emphasize the inherent force and coercion traits of Leviathan, in general, über alles.

Nevertheless, in a formerly republican, now quasi-democratic system, that kind of carefully crafted prose also (inadvertently, I'm sure) negates in many minds, to a large degree, the public’s OWN role and responsibility in forging or shaping Leviathan’s policies and consequent actions, especially absent any real force (a gun to the head, for an albeit extreme example). Alas, are the people not able to discern the obvious and make up their OWN minds? After all, YOU weren’t fooled, Will, I certainly wasn’t fooled, and a host of others, as well, were not fooled, nevermind “bullied,” into supporting this imperial war. Many of us, of course, may not have known all the particulars as to why we didn’t support this war other than it was blatantly unconstitutional (the obvious) which, needless to say, was/is reason enough to oppose it, but we nevertheless saw it as wrong.

It's really this simple: if people can't discern the obvious, they certainly can't be expected to discern the obscure.

So aren’t you implying by logical extension, then, that the public at large is essentially, at the very least, culpable to some degree? Of course, it should be duly noted that public support has greatly wilted over the span of time, but naturally anybody anywhere with a picobrain eventually, after the painful consequences have long been felt, “gets it” when they finally SEE clearly the plane about to crash and burn. Ergo, that’s inconsequential to my point here.

And to clarify, I’m not saying by this that government doesn’t bully or coerce the public on many issues. They’re obviously bullied into paying taxes, among other things, but most of the wars/legislation/ordinances that government actuates are supported by the people collectively themselves. That happens either actively through the ballot box, vocally, or passively by being SILENT and apathetic. The majority’s silence and passivity “speaks” or “roars” louder oftentimes than a minority making some noise.

Will, I gather that you do not subscribe to the maxim that the people get the government they deserve? That statement does not in any way imply what they claim they may want (how they’re talking), but what they actually deserve (how they’re walking).

As I've mentioned before, I really think you're prone to excuse the populace of its own dirty hands in the form of government it "enjoys" (or loathes).

Let the internationalist oligarchy that runs this ...

2007-04-24T05:53:00.000-06:00

Let the internationalist oligarchy that runs this ruined state experience devastating defeat and utter failure in Iraq and in all the other 100+ countries where they have consigned their UN resolution enforcing Hessians. They use us as cannon fodder to fight and die in nations that haven't committed any acts of aggression against us, outsource our best jobs in the blue and white collar professions to India and China while encouraging US companies to move offshore, subsidize foreign competition at taxpayers' expense and leave our borders in a perpetual state of anarchy; and in return we grovel like lickspittle helots eager to pledge our support to the latest cable news hyped, ass clown apparatchik from the Demopublicratican/Recratopubican Party! Oh, look! There's Ichabod Crane Kerry and New Age Tofflerite Gingrich "debating" on CSpan. The Hegelian dialectic displayed in perfect form right on my own Orwellian home telescreen. Pass the popcorn, Osama!

Hate to say this, because too many folks are so so...

2007-04-23T20:26:00.000-06:00

Hate to say this, because too many folks are so soft in the head, but I've believed for the longest time that the only thing that'll bring the troops home would be a bloody defeat with many casualties. Something I fear that only the fool in chief would be brazen enough to initiate. Go ahead and poke Iran in the eye and watch our mid-east Fort Apaches burn to the ground. Thats what it will take to bring the seeds of arrogant hubris to fruition and our ultimate, and well deserved, destruction.