Comments on Pro Libertate: Bruce Jessen: The Torturer in the Pulpit

Really? We're from Aliens and they are the de...

2016-12-10T14:41:08.308-07:00

Really? We're from Aliens and they are the demons. I just read the BYU mission statement concerning honoring your contracts. With whom? With the church and the university, or the Devil? Apr 22, 2016 the ACLU said the courts can proceed with the lawsuit. Mormons, LDS (LSD lol) and they have educational institutions, how convenient for them. This isn't about the psychologists, this is about the U.S. governments and the entities who control it. The doctors wouldn't be able to preform without the governments help. Ok, I know the pair are demons of course, otherwise they wouldn't have offered assistance to begin with. Yet, hey, look who is really controlling things. The problem is that the Aliens aren't doing a good enough job, and they blame us for not changing our behavior and modifying our own DNA. This is why I'm creating the haunting society. When we die we stay in this dimension and haunt the bad guy, like Batman. White light? good luck with that, I will be haunting!

Will, I come from a Mormon upbringing myself. Whe...

2014-12-12T13:01:28.601-07:00

Will, I come from a Mormon upbringing myself. When I told my mom about this, her defense was that I don't know the man. He could've since repented and become a different person.

So I guess my question now is, is there any evidence that he has expressed remose for this in recent years? The most I've heard from him is a quote online concerning the torture report, calling it a bunch of "hooey."

I'd also be curious as to any expressed opinions by that particular congregation on the matter of Jessen.

@Anonymous Dr. Jones was the first to publish a t...

2012-10-31T06:38:22.744-06:00

@Anonymous

Dr. Jones was the first to publish a theory on the possible use of
thermite at the WTC. I read the report when it first came out and
thought very well of him and BYU for having made it public.

But alas, as you have said, Dr. Jones was summarily dismissed from
BYU for having opened his mouth about the subject. It was this
event that called my attention to Mormon politics.

I was very disappointed, to say the least, to discover that BYU is
but just one more brick in the wall. Their treatment of Dr. Jones
was shameful.

This article written by Grigg and the fact the we now may have the
first Mormon president makes me wonder if all of the events aren't
somehow related; of course they are, but "in what way?" is the question
that intrigues me.

I would be curious to know why Jessen decided to s...

2012-10-29T16:11:13.679-06:00

I would be curious to know why Jessen decided to step down from his position as Bishop.

Lofty talk of government officials, as if appointe...

2012-10-29T13:46:45.404-06:00

Lofty talk of government officials, as if appointed by God, is the usual. Let those wanting democracy be left in the hands of elites.

Donna, from North Dakota ~ I'm still flummoxe...

2012-10-28T21:23:28.635-06:00

Donna, from North Dakota ~

I'm still flummoxed over the forced retirement of Dr. Steven Jones, Physicist, from BYU shortly after his research revealed evidence of 'unreacted thermitic material' in dust retrieved from the WTC crime scene.

The following April of 2007, Dick Cheney was honored with a decorative ribbon and several standing ovations at the BYU Graduation ceremony.

Dr. Jones is still struggling over that bit of reality.

Some of us 'Mormons' have been awakened to our 'awful situation' for a number of years; some are just starting to awaken; some evidently, sleep on.

Ignorance of evil should never be mistaken for virtue.

(I don't know how to be anything but "anonymous". Those various options below require too much 'system' commitment. Sorry!)

@workingstiff... Could you possibly be so ignorant...

2012-10-28T16:26:28.409-06:00

@workingstiff... Could you possibly be so ignorant as to not know what has been going on this past decade?

"I consider myself pretty informed, and Mr. G...

2012-10-28T08:58:37.301-06:00

"I consider myself pretty informed, and Mr. Grigg's article
is the first time I heard of Mr. Jensson" -Workingstiff

"Welcome to the desert... of the real." -Morpheus

Before you make pass judgement against the LDS Chu...

2012-10-28T07:57:50.230-06:00

Before you make pass judgement against the LDS Church, let me ask you this: WHAT did the Church leaders know, and WHEN did they know it?

Jessen was the focus of large, well-publicized (at least in the local press) protests in Spokane for many years. ABC and CBS did significant profiles on him, as did the New York Times, several years ago.

His occupation and professional activities were known to church authorities, as was the fact that he had been investigated by the Senate Armed Services Committee. I'm familiar with the vetting of LDS Bishops, and it is impossible to believe that even a cursory background check would have failed to turn up the details of Jessen's career as a torturer.

The first article to which I link makes it clear that the Stake President who called Jessen as Bishop was aware of Jessen's role as an architect of the torture program:

"Bruce Jessen was proposed by Spokane Stake President James Lee, or `called' in the terminology of the Mormon faith, to be the bishop of Spokane’s 6th Ward, approved by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints hierarchy in Salt Lake City and presented to the congregation on Sunday. He was unanimously accepted by some 200 in attendance, Lee said.

As a bishop – an unpaid, part-time position that usually lasts several years – Jessen will take confessions and help people with their personal problems, Lee said. `They just try to help people with their lives, marriages or finances,' he said.

The appointment surprised some groups who have denounced Jessen and his then-partner James Mitchell for techniques they helped develop for the U.S. Central Intelligence Agency to interrogate suspected terrorists after the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks. Among those techniques were sleep deprivation and waterboarding, according to a 2009 U.S. Senate committee report.[...]

Lee ... said he interviewed Jessen about the controversy during the several-month period the psychologist was being considered for the bishop’s post, and Jessen shared some information that Lee couldn’t reveal. He believes Jessen, who has been a member of that congregation for years, is an honorable, trustworthy and humble man who will be able to help other members and keep their confidences. He is, however, `tight-lipped' about his work with the government, the stake president added.

`He’ll take a beating in the press before he sets the record straight,' Lee said. `The whole story has not been told.'"

I agree that the whole story hasn't been told -- in large part because Jessen refuses to answer questions about it and people like President Lee are content to cover for him, rather than demanding that he confess, repent, and make restitution.

It is remarkable to me that Lee appears to be more concerned about the figurative "beating" Jessen has experienced in the media (which has actually ignored this story, for the most part) than the literal beatings -- as well as abuse, mutilation, and psychological strip-mining -- that was inflicted on Jessen's victims, including perfectly innocent people like Binyam Mohamed.

Before you make pass judgement against the LDS Chu...

2012-10-28T07:35:39.243-06:00

Before you make pass judgement against the LDS Church, let me ask you this: WHAT did the Church leaders know, and WHEN did they know it?

I consider myself pretty informed, and Mr. Grigg's article is the first time I heard of Mr. Jensson. Was he publicly indicted? Summoned to Federal court? Was his role promoting these awful interrogation methods published in major media, instead of just smaller outlets that one would have to dig for?

Can it be proven the church knew the background of Mr. Jesson evil career before they sanctioned his bishops calling? You can criticize the Church's claim to receive revelation, but you must prove it knowingly ignored facts public made of his role when it made its decision.

In the Bible it says the even the very elect may be deceived--and that goes for all of us as fallible human beings.

Jessen's 'resignation' in no way remov...

2012-10-27T19:40:23.611-06:00

Jessen's 'resignation' in no way removes the stain on the Mormon heirarchy caused by their original elevation of the sicko to his position of influence and power. A Godly religious body would have excommunicated the evil man from their midst.

@Workingstiff Grigg calls 'em like he sees &#...

2012-10-27T09:00:26.333-06:00

@Workingstiff

Grigg calls 'em like he sees 'em, and he's no rookie.
If you feel ashamed of the Church of LDS, good.
There's hope for you yet.

Power abhors a vacuum. As millions of true Christians
flee state subsidized Church's in the U.S., they are
being replaced with those who deny the power of the Gospel
and as such are intent on taking the Kingdom by force.

Our politicians in the U.S. are now sporting flag lapel pins.
Next, it will be medals.

Thanks for making note of this, Anon. I had mentio...

2012-10-27T00:15:48.153-06:00

Thanks for making note of this, Anon. I had mentioned that apparent development in my update (see the second paragraph). I'm still trying to track down the details.

Hi, Will ~ Had you heard that Mr. Jessen resigned...

2012-10-26T18:26:25.686-06:00

Hi, Will ~

Had you heard that Mr. Jessen resigned from his calling as Bishop of the Spokane 6th Ward?

Someone posted this update on another forum:

http://www.religiondispatches.org/dispatches/joannabrooks/6539/does_romney%E2%80%99s_religion_condone_torture/

"Washington newspapers are reporting that Bruce Jessen was called and “sustained” (or approved) to serve as bishop by his Spokane-area congregation in mid-October. [UPDATE: Sources have confirmed that Jessen stepped down from the position last Sunday.]"

Workingstiff, Mr. Jessen was a key architect of th...

2012-10-26T14:20:07.523-06:00

Workingstiff, Mr. Jessen was a key architect of the torture state. If and when a war criminal of similar stature is appointed to a church position comparable to that of a Bishop in the LDS Church, I will duly note and condemn that development.

The subject of torture is one about which I have written a great deal -- and on several occasions I have expressed dismay and disgust over the fact that professed Evangelical Christians have supported and promoted the practice (beginning in the Philippines a century ago, in fact). I have also described the origins of waterboarding in the Catholic Inquisition. See this essay for one example --

http://freedominourtime.blogspot.com/2009/05/water-cure-for-mancow-disease.html

-- or this one --

http://freedominourtime.blogspot.com/2009/04/triumph-of-torture-state.html

Jessen's denominational affiliation is incidental to the story I shared above. If I had intended to focus attention on the "Mormon connection," I might usefully have pointed out that Jay Bybee, the functionary who signed the "Yoo Memorandum" that supposedly justified torture, is LDS.

In fact, five years ago I wrote an essay lamenting the fact that three key Bush advisers involved in codifying torture, military commissions, and the "unitary executive" doctrine, are members of the LDS Church; I contrasted their actions with those of two of my heroes, Helmuth Heubner, and Alexander Doniphan (the latter being the man who heroically disobeyed an order from his superior to murder Joseph Smith) --

http://freedominourtime.blogspot.com/2007/03/confronting-latter-day-reich-when.html

One of the first essays I published in this space included a tribute -- both angry and sorrowful -- to the late Army Spec. Alyssa Peterson, who died of apparent suicide in Iraq after seeing detainees being broken by interrogators following Robert Jessen's formula. Miss Peterson, who loudly and passionately objected to those tactics, might well have been murdered. The records of the interrogations she witnessed, and those dealing with her death, have been destroyed or sealed away. Miss Peterson was a Mormon, a returned missionary from Flagstaff --

http://freedominourtime.blogspot.com/2006/11/what-regime-does-to-great-americans.html

In a September 2006 essay that probably cost me my job with The New American magazine, I condemned Mitt Romney's enthusiasm for the torture apparatus, and predicted that his embrace of that practice would help him win over bellicose Evangelical Christians; that prediction, I believe, has been vindicated --

http://freedominourtime.blogspot.com/2006/09/grand-old-torture-party.html

I can understand your anger and frustration, Workingstiff, but I cannot honestly be accused of either writing on insinuating that the LDS Church is exceptionally blameworthy regarding the institutionalization of torture. It must be acknowledged that Mr. Jessen's calling as Bishop was approved by the highest councils in Salt Lake City, and unanimously ratified by a sustaining vote by his ward in Spokane, after his role in those crimes became known. The church leaders involved in that calling insist that it originated with God. I would consider that to be a slander against the Creator.

Workingstiff- I'm waiting for Mr. Grigg to enl...

2012-10-26T14:05:21.604-06:00

Workingstiff- I'm waiting for Mr. Grigg to enlighten you, but I'm busy being amused right now.

I am alarmed by the continued criticism of Latter-...

2012-10-26T12:10:39.162-06:00

I am alarmed by the continued criticism of Latter-Day Saints and their faith because of the crimes and sins of men like Jessen and Lee.

I find it unfair that you insinuate the LDS Church or its members condones or even supports such conduct by these men. Stereotyping should be is beneath a man of your intelligence and experience.

Mr. Griggs, for the sake of journalistic objectivity and fairness, why don't you equally name and castigate every single church or faith that fails to respond to Law enforcement officers who belong to their faith, that abuse their authority--of whom you so accurately and lucidly report frequently in your column? Can we expect in future LE expose’s a complete background check and equal castigation of their faiths for being responsible or appearing to condone the moral failures of these individuals? What's good for the goose should be good for the gander, right?

Military Industrial Christian Now that's a ke...

2012-10-26T08:50:55.704-06:00

Military Industrial Christian

Now that's a keeper!

Will, perhaps you can expand on this at a time of ...

2012-10-25T23:22:28.327-06:00

Will, perhaps you can expand on this at a time of your choosing:

Golden Lily Treasure

Note that Lansdale oversaw the interrogation/torture of Yamashita's driver via Romana. It goes back then ('45). And probably before that.

The larger present problem is not just the CIA et al. As Chuck Baldwin expands, it is the American Evangelical Christian. You may have heard of the term Military Industrial Christian. Quite fitting, isn't it?

After the united states fought against the empire ...

2012-10-25T18:16:48.532-06:00

After the united states fought against the empire of spain, a new empire was born. After the united states fought the fascist powers in europe, the preeminent fascist power in the world took on its role of dominance. After the berlin wall fell, the american gulag was added to the "tool kit." This country as been mutilated by war, with the cognitive dissonance of "christians" being only one of its manifestations. They are all calvinist justified sinners. May they burn in hell.

I hope that God has a special place reserved in he...

2012-10-25T17:50:35.961-06:00

I hope that God has a special place reserved in hell for all of these evil people.

The Inquisition is back, with a vengeance. They&#...

2012-10-25T17:23:24.112-06:00

The Inquisition is back, with a vengeance.
They'll have us all wearing U.S. flag
lapel pins before you know it.

And keep in mind that this "interrogation" occurs
before any trial has determined guilt or innocence.

Thank you for having the courage to write about th...

2012-10-25T08:17:56.056-06:00

Thank you for having the courage to write about this--

Say "farewell" to the Christian ethic an...

2012-10-25T07:27:47.254-06:00

Say "farewell" to the Christian ethic and culture that
was once America, and with that demise you can bid adieu
to the shield that protected her as well.

2 Samuel 22:3
The God of my rock; in him will I trust: he is my shield,
and the horn of my salvation, my high tower, and my refuge,
my saviour; thou savest me from violence.

In God we trust? Not.

And this is the sort of sick freak show that so ma...

2012-10-25T03:00:23.632-06:00

And this is the sort of sick freak show that so many Americans cheer about?